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Old 5th October 2012   #67801
christofkdonor
 
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Changed the bars for Spotterbars® (can we say that for OS compacts too ?)
Changed the Centaur 10s cassette for a Record
New pedals
New cabling

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Old 5th October 2012   #67802
ummar01
 
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No - they are SRAM s500 brake levers

To be honest though, I think they are factory butchered, there are massive gaping holes on the underside of the levers where the gear shifters are supposed to be

Quote:
Originally Posted by tommmmmmm View Post
^^ Are those butchered STI levers on it?
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Old 5th October 2012   #67803
B0N0R
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelD View Post
Steeper head tube angle = Faster steering
More rake = Faster steering

Whereas,

Slack head tube = Slow and steady steering
Less rake = Slow and steady steering
I'm still not convinced by all this. If you're tightening the HT you're moving the wheel axles closer but if you make the forks have more rake you're moving them out again? How can that achieve the same characteristics then?

I've always been in the mind set that tight HTs, small rakes, short wheelbase and short stems makes a bike twitchy. This mindset was formed in the world of bmx though, where it seems there is no such thing as an industry standard
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Old 5th October 2012   #67804
Aches and pains
Noob question, I never actually installed a 1'1/8" headset, only 1" headsets, how do you install them? I'm confused, i always thought you just press them in but it seems you need a huge tool, maybe i'm better off going to my lbs? just rather do it at home if possible, can some one clear that up for me? Thanks.

It's for my steamroller by the way, no idea if that makes a difference.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67805
Roymund
 
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The huge tool would be a headset press - you can just press them in but i normally use a block of 2x4 and a rubber mallet

you just need to make sure the headset cups go in straight and fit flush
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Old 5th October 2012   #67806
Roymund
 
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And that's assuming you meant 1 1/8" threadless
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Old 5th October 2012   #67807
edscoble
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ummar01 View Post
No - they are SRAM s500 brake levers

To be honest though, I think they are factory butchered, there are massive gaping holes on the underside of the levers where the gear shifters are supposed to be
Quite normal, only the Campagnolo Record singlespeed levers managed to fill in the gaping holes.

The rubber hood still have cut out for the shifter thought.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67808
ummar01
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edscoble View Post
Quite normal, only the Campagnolo Record singlespeed levers managed to fill in the gaping holes.

The rubber hood still have cut out for the shifter thought.
Any recommendations for a smaller lever? Not convinced by the SRAM - would prefer something that doesn't feel so long
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Old 5th October 2012   #67809
christofkdonor
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edscoble View Post
Quite normal, only the Campagnolo Record singlespeed levers managed to fill in the gaping holes.

The rubber hood still have cut out for the shifter thought.

The $30 Tektro RL520 are not butchered, have a strong spring that prevent rattling when using a dummy lever, and can be found in black or silver. I don't understand why everyone insists on getting Campagnolo or SRAM and not these (or the Cane Creek SRC-5C ones which I didn't try).

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Images/Models/Full/34840.jpg
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Images/Models/Full/27937.jpg
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Old 5th October 2012   #67810
edscoble
 
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Shimano's singlespeed levers are very nice, the R400 a bit flexy, haven't tried the R600 which I assumed should be less flexy.

Having said that, it's quite a personal choice, the Shimano and Campag levers are reasonably small.

Quote:
Originally Posted by christofk View Post
The $30 Tektro RL520 are not butchered, have a strong spring that prevent rattling when using a dummy lever, and can be found in black or silver. I don't understand why everyone insists on getting Campagnolo or SRAM and not these (or the Can Creek ones).[/IMG]
I'm talking about butchered levers specifically rather than those stand-alone singlespeed one, the obvious answer to why people go for those expensive levers is that the shape and feel are great, especially the SRAM, unfortunately I too found the SRAM to feel quite bulky despite having a great levers shape.

I got Campagnolo Record singlespeed levers simply because they were really comfortable, luckily got them second hand, however given that Campagnolo are easy to service, you can get a cheap Xenon set second hand and removed the shifting part.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67811
christofkdonor
 
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The shape and feel of the Tektro is also great. And I have Records hoods on the road bike (the Look on this page above) so I can compare.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67812
ummar01
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by christofk View Post
The $30 Tektro RL520 are not butchered, have a strong spring that prevent rattling when using a dummy lever, and can be found in black or silver. I don't understand why everyone insists on getting Campagnolo or SRAM and not these (or the Cane Creek SRC-5C ones which I didn't try).
I tried the Tektro levers but found the hoods quite hard, when using for any length of time my palms would start to tingle. SRAM's are softer but massive in the hand....
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Old 5th October 2012   #67813
edscoble
 
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could be anything, too much pressure on the handlebar, saddle not tilted horizontally (or nosed up a bit) etc.

used to get really bad tingle on my palm, quick adjustment on saddle removed it.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67814
christofkdonor
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edscoble View Post
used to get really bad tingle on my palm, a few extra spacers removed it.
could'nt resist
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Old 5th October 2012   #67815
withered preacherdonor
 
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I now have a set of the SRAMs; I found the Tektro/Cane Creeks had too much of a valley for me. I still need to install, but the shape seems much more what I'm looking for. (Thanks to _tester for the suggestion)
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Old 5th October 2012   #67816
AngelD
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Regal View Post
^^ It's not the head tube or rake per se, it's mostly about the trail that results from the combination of those factors.

This is probably the article you're thinking of, that mentions the touring bike characteristics:

http://www.cyclingtips.com.au/2011/0...bike-handling/

But it's not because they're used at slower speeds. The lower bottom bracket and longer chainstays improves their high-speed characteristics, not worsens them.

I think there's a popular misconception that track bikes are better handling, or faster handling than road bikes. They're inherently less stable, but within such a range that it doesn't create problems for the rider.
That wasn't the article I was thinking of, but I have read it and it'll do!

It is indeed the smaller a trail is (distance from a imaginary line from in the same angle, and from, the head tube center, to the point directly under the front axle), the faster its front end handling.

But, as you say, the rear end handling (you steer with the back of the bike too!) is also dependent on the BB drop and chain stay length.

More BB drop means we can apply our weight to make a lower center of gravity and use that to control the rear end, like how we hunker down into a corner, it equates to easier and better control of the bike.

Chain stay length seems to go that the longer the stays are, the better the ride quality... yes, I did just say tight rear clearances aren't necessarily better!

They have traditionally used shorter stays because of the stiffness needed that they simply didn't have from the material technologies, but we've advanced a hell of a lot from the 60s - 70s, and having chain stays as short as possible simply isn't needed anymore as we have much better materials, but can also shape the materials in incredibly stiffer shapes with varying sidewall thicknesses.

Quote:
Originally Posted by B0N0R View Post
I'm still not convinced by all this. If you're tightening the HT you're moving the wheel axles closer but if you make the forks have more rake you're moving them out again? How can that achieve the same characteristics then?

I've always been in the mind set that tight HTs, small rakes, short wheelbase and short stems makes a bike twitchy. This mindset was formed in the world of bmx though, where it seems there is no such thing as an industry standard
Wheelbase length does effect things, a long train is very stable at high speeds, but its cornering radius is horrific compared to a sports wheelchair for instance, which can turn on the spot, but I wouldn't want to be in a wheelchair doing a ton down the M4!

So the wheelbase of your frame is a balance between speed stability and agility.

When you're driving, you use larger movements the slower you're going, but if you used that same movement doing a ton down the M4, what's gonna happen?

So, faster bikes actually need to steer slower.

If you measure the actual distance traveled by a short rake fork and that of a longer rake fork, which fork moves the furthest?

Its the longer rake fork that moves the most, not something you want to happen at speed with an already twitchy frame because of its high BB, short wheelbase, and steep head tube angle, which is why track bikes have to have less rake to be stable enough to ride.


Please someone explain it better if I've not got it right or it isn't clear!

Last edited by AngelD; 5th October 2012 at 16:12.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67817
TMdonor
 
TM's Avatar
I fitted a fork with less rake to the smash and it made the steering twitchier, which I liked.

Due to this practical experiment I will now ignore any other posts on the matter, including the above, which seems like speculation rather than fact.

My opinion, a fast bike would want twitchier steering for sharper manoeuvring in dicey situations. Touring bikes with more rake have more relaxed stable steering due to long hours on the road and load bearing.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67818
AngelD
 
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Have a look at the link Regal posted, it explains it better than I can, and is written by a frame builder to boot.

And I'm sorry to say TM, but if the two forks had the same axle to crown length, it is impossible for the shorter rake fork to have been twitchier/faster unless it was also more flexible, and that was the flex that made it feel "twitchier".

I've read papers, interviews, and advice from frame builders and other knowledgeable bods and they all agree, less trail = faster handling, and less rake = more trail, not less.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67819
AngelD
 
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This is another article that explains some of it - http://www.dclxvi.org/chunk/tech/trail/
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Old 5th October 2012   #67820
AngelD
 
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This is the one I was trying to find though! - http://davesbikeblog.blogspot.co.uk/...le-bit-of.html
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Old 5th October 2012   #67821
AngelD
 
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Quote from a motorbike site explaining trail characteristics -

Quote:
Too litte trail:
With negative or too little trail the bike will handle well at low speeds but will easily develop a dangerous wobble at high speed.

Normal Trail:
The trail should be... (motorcycle correct distance) so that the bike handles easily at both high and low speeds.

Too much Trail:
You will have trouble balancing the bike at low speeds and it will handle sluggishly at high speeds.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67822
Aches and pains
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roymund View Post
The huge tool would be a headset press - you can just press them in but i normally use a block of 2x4 and a rubber mallet

you just need to make sure the headset cups go in straight and fit flush
Okay thanks, I think ill just take the frame over to my lbs and let them do it

Yes its 1'1/8" threadless
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Old 5th October 2012   #67823
Aches and pains
Personaly think, Twitchy = more control, when your used to it
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Old 5th October 2012   #67824
kerob
 
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you can make yourself a rudimentary headset press using some threaded rod a few washers some wood and a couple of spanners. but basically, make sure the cups go in straight.

a la https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=ho...Ioq80QW8-4DgAw
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Old 5th October 2012   #67825
Aches and pains
Would be something i will eventually get or make, i think it would be better if i went in when the lbs isn't to busy and actually watch them do it, or maybe even do it while they help.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67826
edscoble
 
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Just go on youtube and find a video showing you how to press the headset.

it's as straightforward as other make it out to be, just tightened it one by one checking the headset if it's in-line with the steerer tube.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67827
ChrisMGSdonor
 
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Cross Check project of radness is complete. Needs a few little adjustments and then she'll be perfect. Feels odd but fantastic after 4-5 years of fixed. Photos soon.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67828
Aches and pains
Yeah seems simple enough, i got everything else to build the rest of bike at home, i may give it a go, but if i go to my lbs i can use the proper tools and cut down the fork properly to, if i pick the right time they should let me do it my self.

Ordered everything but the headset to get my surly ride-able, then i will finish it off at the end of the month, make sure i don't end up with a 10er left in my account and living on toast again :P

Total £106.55 GBP - and now we wait...
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Old 5th October 2012   #67829
ChrisMGSdonor
 
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In transit earlier today:

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Old 5th October 2012   #67830
wharry
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wharry View Post
New (slightly more sensible) setup for my commuter.


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Old 5th October 2012   #67831
ChrisMGSdonor
 
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Preview. Excuse the "I need something to ride home with" pedals:

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Old 5th October 2012   #67832
boredomdonor
 
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^^I kinda like it more as it is now.

Last edited by boredom; 5th October 2012 at 21:15. Reason: In response to wharry
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Old 5th October 2012   #67833
spaynem
 
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Old 5th October 2012   #67835
psee
Quote:
Originally Posted by B0N0R View Post
ftfy

what basket is that?
Just one of those standard ones that sits on every other town/ladies bike. Looks a bit sketchy but sturdy enough to carry some groceries etc..
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Old 5th October 2012   #67836
Dammit
 
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Old 5th October 2012   #67837
Buckaroo
 
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Yes! This thread needs more scales ;)
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Old 5th October 2012   #67838
edscoble
 
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Chris, get Problem Solver Travel Agent for V-brake - they make it feel more like powerful caliper brakes.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67839
Dammit
 
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I was surprised, 34g difference between standard and PM equipped cranks.

Of course, the PM is compact and the Cipo Gold rings are standard, but still.
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Old 5th October 2012   #67840
radardonor
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edscoble View Post
Chris, get Problem Solver Travel Agent for V-brake - they make it feel more like powerful caliper brakes.
I've got a pair of these on order along with some Deore XT V brakes for my Tricross. Do they really work well? I havered over it for ages because the whole set up seems like it should introduce lots of friction and slop into the system.
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Old 6th October 2012   #67841
ChrisMGSdonor
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edscoble View Post
Chris, get Problem Solver Travel Agent for V-brake - they make it feel more like powerful caliper brakes.
For sure. I bought some but they're the wrong type. I got the "inline" versions for use with mechanical disk brakes... Need to try and find some of the normal one's today in London and get the brakes sorted. They feel pretty soft at the moment, and I'm using Avid Single Digit Ultimates / Mavic Ceramic rims / Swissstop blue pads, so in theory they should be fucking amazing.

Really looking forward to a proper ride once I've got these few niggles sorted out.

Also, what do you think about using a Planet X carbon CX fork instead of the Surly steel one? Got one here and not sure what to do with it.



Vs.

http://www.nordicskiersports.com/images/crosscheck.jpg

Not going to be doing any heavy touring.

Last edited by ChrisMGS; 6th October 2012 at 00:41.
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Old 6th October 2012   #67842
ChadTheInhaler
Anyone have any thoughts on the On * One Kaffenbach frameset? I'm considering one for my tourer project. That is unless I find a decent 2nd hand frame of some sort.
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Old 6th October 2012   #67843
Eamesy
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChadTheInhaler View Post
Anyone have any thoughts on the On * One Kaffenbach frameset? I'm considering one for my tourer project. That is unless I find a decent 2nd hand frame of some sort.
I've also been looking at one of these for the girlfriend. As you say, unless you go second hand, there doesn't seem to be anything that compares in that price point.
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Old 6th October 2012   #67844
ChrisMGSdonor
 
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Basically a Pompino with gears right? They look nice. Check Singletrackworld Classifieds as they sometimes come up for sale there.
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Old 6th October 2012   #67845
AngelD
 
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ChrisMGS - Post some proper DS photos please! Been looking forward to seeing this one turned out.

wharry - I kinda agree with boredom, always has been a pretty frame, but for every day riding that looks about perfect, saddle helps with that, but it altogether works very nicely.
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Old 6th October 2012   #67846
1000archangels
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmx_fred View Post
http://i477.photobucket.com/albums/rr134/bmx_fred/IMG_2270-1.jpg
I think your fork is front to back

otherwise nice stable
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Old 6th October 2012   #67847
psee
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChadTheInhaler View Post
Anyone have any thoughts on the On * One Kaffenbach frameset? I'm considering one for my tourer project. That is unless I find a decent 2nd hand frame of some sort.
Just finishing mine. Been a fun build and will hopefully serve me well in a couple adventures next year. Some parts are to be swapped out (stem, saddle..) Haven't done any riding yet but the frame feels solid.
Only downside is that it only takes 32mm tyres with fenders. Won't be doing any offroad riding anyways though.

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Old 6th October 2012   #67848
nutsjesmoardonor
 
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Searched long for this one, finally found one in the right size, 80.


Got my full Dura Ace build almost completed, only looking for the handlebars, but won't probably find them :(
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Old 6th October 2012   #67849
XH
 
XH's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisMGS View Post
Preview. Excuse the "I need something to ride home with" pedals:

Moar pics plz
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Old 6th October 2012   #67850
ChrisMGSdonor
 
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Needs to be perfect and then the pics will come. Patience. Can't even see the Zipp logos on the bars at the moment.
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