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OK, as it's all installed now and much smoother than before and allow it to break in. No qualms at all about the cranks but if the SRAM BB gives out soon as many accounts I've read say it will then I've been considering the Phil Wood OBB. Chris King do a GXP / Truvativ BB but don't have an Italian option. I thought that Phil only did square taper but have discovered that they not only have this OBB in Italian thread but also offer an adapter for GXP cranks. Next item on the wish list then . . .

We did measure the width and check that with the spacer it wouldn't be too wide. It was 69.5mm including the spacer after facing just inside the Italian width.

Did yours run well from day one or did they require a break in period?

Swayed by all the pro GXP postings and nothing to support the case of the poor old square taper I spent a few hours having another go at this. Instead of facing my own shell and risking a bad result a spare frame (made by the same frame builder) with an Italian threaded shell was used. It was due for a new paint job anyway.

The shell was faced and we took out the BB from mine and put it in there. My wheels were also put onto it along with a set of bars and saddle to try it out. Result - much smoother than what I had experienced yesterday on my own bike but still not quite as smooth as the old Miche square taper that I had before.

I had limited time as I needed to cycle back to Sydenham so decided to give it a try on mine. We stripped the experiment bike and then my own shell was faced. That meant that now there was contact between the spider and the stay. With no Italian size BB spacer available we created a split ring using an English sized one. Plenty of grease and everything fitted perfectly.

Verdict - much smoother ride and the cranks do spin better than yesterday . . . but, there is still drag. That loose spinning that you can feel going down a hill just wasn't there. Perhaps they (the cups) need time to break in so I'll give it a few more days. But it doesn't feel like an upgrade. All very interesting research and learning though.

They're silver and have a black 48T chainring. 170mm. About to head up to Walthamstow now. So they will be available from Racer Rosa. I have both BSA and Italian cups in terms of BB.

As they were only fitted last night I've only ridden about 3 (tough) hours on them. Aside from the tight BB the cranks themselves feel good and I get better control especially a sense of connection between the left and right foot. Seem to have more control going slowly and am able do tighter turns.

You can imagine that I've scouring the interwebs a whole lot today and there are more bad reports about the BB than good ones. The grease leaked out or crunching noises were heard within a month. Most posts and blogs talk about repacking the bearings with lighter grease and opening up the seals to do so. Then repeating the maintenance once a month or so. How come I didn't come across these results when I was researching the cranks? All I got then was SRAM Omnium vs Sugino 75. But I guess I was researching the cranks rather than the BB and my focus was there.

I'm prepared to service my BB no more than once a year if that. Fit and forget. So even if facing the shell does work I've already lost my faith in this set up. Tomorrow they're coming off.

I've got a good amount of clearance between the arms and the chainstays but only a tiny clearance between the spider and the chainstay which worries me. I know some people can live with that and even if it is tiny it is still clearance but I don't feel safe somehow, so for that reason I'm out.

Very soon there will be a set of SRAM Omnium cranks up for a grabs along with almost new BB.

So you guys reckon I should face the shell and give it another go?

Thanks Howard. This crankset had been much anticipated so it's been quite a disappointing experience. I got them fitted at Racer Rosa in Walthamstow last night. We did actually consider facing the shell especially as the tools are all there but because there was such a tight clearance between the crank arm spider and chainstay (about 2mm) we thought that the paint layer might act as a shim. The frame itself had already been faced and our theory was that the powder coat layer wouldn't really make much of a difference. But perhaps it has.

Had a long conversation with Diego about it this morning considering lots of other alternatives and have planned to get them removed tomorrow morning and go for a Miche Advanced instead which he has in stock and square taper BB. I'm sure I can sell the Omnium with BB and cover some costs.

I guess I could try facing the shell but the clearance would then be even tighter and I wouldn't be able to relax while spinning fast down a hill. My heels were also coming into contact with the cranks this afternoon. Only brushing but still a little disconcerting. So all in a all a big thumbs down.

I have a Miche Primato double fixed hub by the way.

I just got a set of Omniums fitted yesterday. They're really smooth and the chainline is perfect. Clearance is very tight on the drive side though. Got a new Italian threaded GXP bottom bracket which is seriously tight. Cycled home from E17 to Sydenham and it felt like riding uphill all the way.

Really don't fancy shelling out loads on a CK bb or opening up the seals and putting lower viscosity grease in there so I may just ditch the whole set up and go back to square taper and get a Miche Advanced crankset.

So annoying after looking forward to this upgrade for so long.

I've bought a klickfix mini map holder and a laser printer. I noticed a few people on the Kidds Toys event with those. I think I need to ponder the whole GPS thing a bit more. I had a read through the GPS thread. Perhaps I could borrow or rent one to try out. I have an android phone which as "car mode" that has a gps receiver. I could try and get a handlebar mount to see how that goes. But old skool paper for now.

Got a lovely email response from Richard Phipps who does the FWC cards. He's going to add the points for Kidds Toys (he saw me at the start and knows from Billy that I managed to finish it) and says that the points may be carried over from one season to the next. Cool. A few DIY London to Brighton rides should clock up a few points. Which I guess is the next thing to sort out - contacting the organiser about my proposed route.

I've entered the London Sightseer. Will be on fixed again as it's my only bike. Need to get a route sheet handlebar mount and a bottle cage. Don't fancy getting dehydrated again.

Thanks for the FWC tips Greenbank. I'm going to get those points in the bank. I also want to do a DIY London to Brighton. I did one a couple of weeks ago as a training ride but only read about doing DIY routes later on. It was 97km from my house to my friend's house in Brighton. I didn't do Ditchling but Devil's Dyke but still didn't make it up the hill.

Anyone use GPS devices? I liked the route sheet but you sort of get focused on that more than the ride like you have very short controls. I've been recommended the Garmin Edge 800 but at £300 it's over my budget. I've seen some Etrex Vista HCx going 2nd hand for about £70 on ebay. Thoughts?

Did my first Audax ride yesterday. This one

http://www.aukweb.net/events/detail/12-82/

I normally ride 47 x 18 round town but decided to drop it down to 47 x 19 (68 gear) to tackle the hills and the longer distance. It was seriously hilly and probably would have struggled with a much lower ratio. But I made it to the end and managed to add an extra 20km from getting lost. Definitely didn't eat and drink enough and wondered if I'd make it on many occasions.

The weather was superb though and the views were stunning. Going through the little Kent villages gave a wonderful touring feel to it but I think I'll go for flat one next time.

I've just read that you need to apply for a separate card to get the fixed wheel points so don't think I'll get those. So I'll bear that in mind for the next one. Plus map mounting and bottle cage. Big thanks to Google Maps for helping me out when I got lost. Oh and 3G connections out in the country.

Thinking about this one next

http://www.aukweb.net/events/detail/12-559/

It's around London.

If you've got one in your shed or in the cupboard under the stairs I'll take it off your hands. Need a couple more for my wheel building classes.

Post on this thread, PM or email (arupsen48@gmail.com).

Cheers,
Arup

Two confirmed booking for the 24th so two places left.

Next lesson date is now up - 24th of June. Again Sunday, 3-7. Look back over this thread for more info. I'm also now offering the opportunity to just learn the skills using old parts so you won't need to bring anything.

Lol. Perhaps I need to allow odd numbers for spoke count then.

Based on Damon Rinards SpocalcExpress.xls I built this mainly as a programming exercise but I find myself using it a lot for the last few dozen wheel builds.

http://yogarup.com/wheels/hubs

I've just done an update because you couldn't put in whole numbers into the centre to flange and flange diameter fields but I'm also thinking about putting in allowed ranges so that if you put in a number that is outside that range you'll get an error message. E.g. you put in 6040 for ERD and wonder what's going on. I've already put in a check for odd numbers in the spoke count field.

But would that be a good safety feature or too restricting? Just looking for some feedback really.

What is the lowest spoke count and what is the highest?

What is the lowest ERD and what is the highest?

Same for spoke hole diameter, flange diameter and centre to flange.

Remember this is a really simple one and only does one side of the wheel and you have to know all the measurements.

I've made some videos to explain how to measure and will put them on my site soon.

Thanks everyone.

OK everyone, the next planned group session is on the 27th of May. That's more than 2 weeks to get your bits together. Any questions, please ask. Check back through this thread for more details and have a look at the site.

I'm planning on doing them once a month but if you want a one-to-one session then you can book your session any time that suits.

Next one is on March 25th. Usual time - Sunday 3.00 - 7.00. You can book up on the classes page.
http://yogarup.com/wheels/classes

And just to make it a triple. I've got a spoke length calculator app on my site now. It only does one side but it's accurate and I've used it on many builds that I've done.

If it's not possible to get spokes through the drive side then you can build a partial wheel using the non-drive side so that you can get your chain whip on there or lock ring. I have a hub in a similar condition that requires the same treatment.

I've got some used Open Pro's that still have a bit of life in them. You can have them for very cheap price. (Read free). I can teach you build a wheel if you want to learn. Or you can follow my video tutorials. I also have an open sport that is in fairly good nic.

Sunday 26th Feb. Times as above. Two bookings so 2 spaces left.

Got a date for the end of Jan 2012 on Sunday 29th from 3.00 - 7.00pm. Have one booking already. I imagine it will take place indoors as even with sunny weather it's too cold for the garden. You need to book it via my wheel site.

http://yogarup.com/wheels/classes.php