Avatar for JWestland


Member since Jan 2013 • Last active Aug 2019

Over the water in Norn Ire, serious cycle commuter, and a bit of a bike geek.

Also draw, studying for IT/Maths degree on OU and I keep chickens.

Most recent activity

  • in Miscellaneous and Meaningless
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    Labour is not doing well in the polls and the LibDems are taking mostly Conservative voters...but even a few Labour ones.

    In a proportional voting system it would be good by splitting Conservatives, but I don't know for sure it will pan out.

    Can't be worse than what we have now you'd think...but then I thought that before :)

  • in Miscellaneous and Meaningless
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    There was even a withdrawal agreement with the EU :-)

    But not really, as it has not passed parliament. May made a stupid mistake by not involved all parties and everybody that voted to invoke A50 without parliament also made a stupid mistake, why vote for something big before seeing any sort of plan. Amazing.

    Are you going to let the presentation or leadership style of May put you off the deal?

    Threats to bypass parliament are pretty serious stuff.

    How does that change what happens next?

    Well, actually...it can a lot. The government is not setup to deal with something as big as Brexit that can run over several governments. Breaking trust is not going to help there.

    Too much faith was put on amendments a/ passing and b/ holding any weight again due to a disconnect, a miss-reading of the political climate outside Westminster

    The climate that now polls towards Remain?

    But yes, that is now the past. Going forward I think first thing is that parliament has to get back control and sneaking out a Brexit w/o approval should be stopped.

    Then hurdle two if there is a GE...ask the EU for an extension. Again, parliament may have to force it.

    Ideally, not a GE because Labour looks like they are going to lose big time and it it not even likely yet that the LibDems will get enough votes for a coalition with Labour (akwards silences during negotiations to follow)

    Perhaps another round of votes (the EU will sign up to a CU/SM agreement pretty quickly I think and no backstop is needed for that, so, em, everybody wins? Brexit done, not too much damage to the UK...) will happen, but it all depends on what will happen in September.

    Perhaps the WA is revived and put to a public vote VS Remain/No Deal <-- really...but that may happen and then another "fun" campaign follows.

    For everyone's sake and sanity and peace a SM/CU Brexit is my preference, I really rather Remain but it is going to eat up more time (and the UK has some big issues to sort) and then hopefully we can move on.

    But if there IS another vote, well I am waiting on citizenship acceptance and then I will go round the doors to get people to vote. Which will be "fun" in some Belfast areas :)

  • in Miscellaneous and Meaningless
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    But you can also argue that is appeasement of something based on lies and threats that cannot be delivered. There is no "Brexit that works for jobs/one that stops the furrin's/one that gives the UK more sovereignity..."

    The behaviour of May (invoking A50 and bypassing parliament and all sorts) hasn't exactly been of a good standard.

    "Do vote for this, or you get Boris" is not really an argument, but a threat.

    And some of the proposals for alternatives to the WA/stopping a hard Brexit failed on a few votes.

  • in Miscellaneous and Meaningless
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    If we'd gone for a soft Brexit following the A50 vote, leaving the EU, losing our MEPs, and remaining in the CU/SM, remainers like me would've accepted it.

    Same here, though living in NI I can tell you that trying to ditch either the CU/SM would be Backstop Hell all over again.

    The UK simply doesn't have the patience to negotiate something that can be checked with technology and then spend 10 years and lots of £££££ to build it.

  • in Miscellaneous and Meaningless
    Avatar for JWestland

    Neither do I, but do you think by now the rhetorics are really getting out of hand? It is not just Farage anymore, but the actual PM of the UK.

    Anyways, my very first point was that often conversations are "driven" by fearmongering/anger creation, and then called "the will of the people".

    The attacks on Polish immigrants, refugees as cockroaches, I don't see what is perse conspiracy theory about it. The idea is to stir people up, make sure they don't think clearly/logically and then claim it to be "will of the people"

  • in Miscellaneous and Meaningless
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    I don't know if you have missed it... but somehow judges are now "the enemy of the people" (sorta standard the Sun really) but now the rhetorics of the -government- (not all MPs) is quite messed up atm.

    I don't really see how that is a conspiracy theory, it is in plain sight.

    Because it all blamed on "Ireland" "Remainers" whatever, and when such groups air fears it is "project fear".

    I'd hope that anybody invoking "the people" would actually try to get everyone on board. Not just a subgroup and then shout down everyone else.

    As for immigration bullshit Charlie Brooker's newswipe section from ages ago, well it hasn't really changed.


    But, I'm all for more input of everyone. The ROI referendum system is quite sound, citizen groups work really well. I am just extremely wary of the "UK first WILL OF THE PEOPLE" sort of cherrypicking.

  • in Miscellaneous and Meaningless
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    Ireland already said "lol no" to that.

    Merkel gave him 30 days to come up with something. Edit: she suggested 30 days...he suggested that was fine by him. Well if he drops the red lines...he can. CU and SM brexit saviour?

  • in Miscellaneous and Meaningless
    Avatar for JWestland

    Pffff.... where did I mention conspiracies?

    Simple example: Immigration. Dog whistling about Turkey (leave.eu), uncontrolled immigration (is it though), conflating refugees/EU immigrants... that is driving a conversation to go somewhere they want it to go.

    Not: Hm is Immigration lowering wages? Good question. Let's do research. Oh. Actually it's a really complex picture. By then all the fear creation has already been done.

    So you go from not complete baseless fair enough fears translatable into direct policies into a glut of underbelly vagueness.

    And on immigration...turns out the UK attitudes are very positive ATM. Yet "the will of the people" is still in time at stuck at Farage and his posters.

  • in Miscellaneous and Meaningless
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    Except those in charge let "the people" say whatever they want them to say. We are all "the people". But somehow only when it suits.

    And the UK press fact free fear mongering, how can you quell fears that are a fantasy?

    We have to see what happens when parliament is back.

    May's WA was also not the end and in a way just kicking the can down the road, which is another problem as technically a new parliament isn't bound by the previous one after a GE.

    The wa may just pass this time if there are more votes, but we don't know yet what will happen. A GE may be most likely.

  • in Miscellaneous and Meaningless
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    I still don't trust him as a non Brexiter. Zero opposition, calling for A50 with the Tories in power, same tired old talk about ending freedom of movement cos reasons, suggesting the EU will block railway nationalisation, huge amount of fence sitting... I could go on.

    But that's neither here nor there, as Labour has committed to a confirmatory vote on anything that passes parliament. And he did go out and campaign.

    If the libdems don't want to continually hear "but austerity" they better add some nuance themselves once someone else / another party changes tactics./ views.