Chat about Novel Coronavirus - 2019-nCoV - COVID-19

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  • It tells you when you install it.

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  • Yeah Dj, you mention your his and hers chainsaw and axes, by your own admission, quite often. So making a comment that maybe you chainsaw and axe comments was worthy of the golf thread, not copying it to the golf bat thread just a comment deserves you try to get some retribution.

    Hope that the comment gives you satisfaction and the feeling that the great injustice perpetrated on you has been righted.

  • It also tells you when it's working (with Bluetooth on) and warns you when you have Bluetooth turned off.

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    • Screenshot_20210722-170101_NHS Covid-19.jpg
  • Notification warning stays on when bluetooth is off.

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    • _20210722_171604.JPG
  • Not to my recollection. But that doesn't mean much.

    @Stonehedge So it is something you can opt out of? As I said I did not know. Maybe I didn't read anything as I download the app so I could buy something as I had to check in before I could be served. So I didn't know. Is it that difficult to believe?

  • Is it that difficult to believe?

    I haven't in any way suggested I disbelieve you about anything!

    Was just pointing out that the app really clearly states that Bluetooth is required.

  • Shows how much I pay attention to the app. Suppose I should go and look at the settings on phone but that would mean moving.

  • What are the user numbers with the app in the UK?
    In Germany basically no one has it installed.
    For yesterday it shows me 1890 new infections and 316 warnings by app users, which seems to make it useless.

  • What are the user numbers with the app in the UK?

    AIUI due to the design of the app it's impossible to really say how many are actively using it over any period.

    There were 20M+ downloads as of December 2020 but that could be people redownloading it after deleting it.

    There were 600,000+ pinged by the app last week, so it's definitely used well in the UK, but I think it's going to start to wane as it becomes too good at its job and (for some) doesn't take into account vaccination status.

  • The App:-
    Reading the spiel on the .gov website. For it to hit you have to be close 2m to someone for 15mins for it to take effect. In the two days before mine alerted me to isolate I wasn't near anyone for 15mins except the wife.

  • Even assuming that everything else works perfectly, I can't imagine that Bluetooth signal strength / relative strength is particularly accurate for measuring distance.

    There's probably a bunch of papers on it though, if i get a spare hour

  • Neighbour through the walls?

  • Was in a bar end date -14 but used the app to sign in. Would have thought that a phone call from that. May be the multi millions thrown at it with little transpersancy and no open source is coming back to haunt them.
    I'm generally a follower of rules, but feel more challenging now than I have been.

  • It's accurate to within a range of +/- 2 metres. Like all radio measurements though, it works best when it can triangulate with two other devices.

  • Shows how much I pay attention to the app.

    You asked a lots of questions you already know/can easily find out but choose to ignore the apps that you also use?

  • Doesn't that mean that the distance being measured being within the margin of error?

  • It’s doing crude signal strength measurement. I can’t imagine generic Bluetooth hardware is capable of time of flight or Doppler shift analysis to get actual distances.

  • So more or less the same as here, we have 27M downloads, and my rough calculation is that there are 68M smartphone users.
    That's better than I thought, but I still don't get that people happily running FB and Google stuff don't have it installed.

  • still don't get that people happily running FB and Google stuff don't have it installed.

    Running the app means you might get pinged and be unable to go to work/go on holiday/whatever. Google and Facebook don't hit your wallet in the same way

  • I think it does.

  • It's a very blunt tool in this instance.

  • Phones don't have the hardware or timekeeping capabilities to do distance calculations. Well, other than their GPS, Glonass and Galileo chips which only work outdoors.

    The NHS app uses Bluetooth RSSI (Received Signal Strength Indicator) to estimate proximity. It's essentially the relative signal strength at the receiving end.

    Comparing RSSI between devices is meaningless because it's a figure calculated using your specific device's antenna setup, chipset, and position (being in your pocket attenuates signal for example) but as it's a logarithmic scale, it's really good for detecting if something is close or not.

    This is an RSSI plot for two specific phones in free space.

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    • a-Curve-fitting-for-RSSI-values-at-distances-from-0-to-7-meters-in-Environment-1.png
  • That is the same logic as not taking a test in case you have proof of covid.

    This was an supposed issue with the working poor/gig economy.

    EDIT: But the vaccine has a tracking chip.....yet forgetting the real tracker....

  • After having a play with the phone, the bluetooth is activated on the phone but doesn't connect to anything...I'm using an old phone and pyg sim for the app.

    So proof of my lack of attention.

    Tho I have not been anywhere for longer than 15 with out the GF and we both scan qr codes.

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Chat about Novel Coronavirus - 2019-nCoV - COVID-19

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