Blood on the streets

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  • Patrick Field (of the London School of Cycling and founder of the Dunwich D) had often mentioned (predicted) that there would be a period where there would be 'blood on the streets' as cycling increased and driver behavior and understanding lagged behind.

    This week is terrible

  • What a shit and insensitive fucking thread.

  • It's a shit and terrible week.
    This is a vent and off the rider down threads

  • And you said that the black logo dangerises cycling...

  • I know I did. We are in a strange place where riding numbers are snowballing despite the dangerisation. Each death and injury is intolerable and unnecessary
    How many other people are killed in addition to those poor riders, by people in motors.
    How many Pedestrians and car passengers?

  • Its a shame, most people will stick to what they learn as a child and hug the curb or will not have developed the skill set to be self-aware and things become dangerous. I don’t think that drivers are the main problem, when I head out I consider every vehicle/ person an idiot and take responsibility for my own wellbeing never relying on highway code and road laws and often going against them to stay out of danger/ harm

  • Drivers cause the death and injury
    They are the problem
    Cycling is benign and drivers need to take extra extra care around people out of cars whether on foot or bikes

  • No, drivers are involved but it doesn’t always put them at fault. Cycling is far from benign, think of all the times you see someone do something you wouldn’t do; be it under taking in a bad situation or not looking back before drifting into a lane that seems clear, etc. If drivers were 100% careful then this wouldn’t matter but there not and never will be its up to the cyclist to learn cycling safety and reduce the number of potential accidents.

  • 68% of cyclist injuries are the fault of the driver, so drivers are mainly the problem.

    it is true that early cycling instincts are to hug the curb, not signal a lot and so on but once you're past that, unless you're cycling like a maniac then it's mostly drivers.

  • Found this in relation to vehicle deaths on the road, slightly out of date but still an interesting insight into deaths on the road.­m

  • True, but the increase of accidents happens with an increase of cyclist so a large portion of these accidents will be new cyclists, my point is not that drivers don’t have any blame but that cyclist should be taught to look out for themselves as they will be at risk not the drivers.
    If you teach people to be safer on both sides then the most benefit will be seen. I have had idiot drivers left hook me, swing left (into me) to turn right, open doors on me, not predict my speed and pull out on me all sorts: I’m not justifying these actions I’m just say each one has taught me to be wary of these events and threw being aware of them I have learnt to predict (with a lot less accuracy than I would like) which drivers will do it and which wont and how to avoid it. This is a grounding that most new cyclist don’t have and it just takes one event of this nature to kill. So I am in no way defending every driver but it doesn’t help to only look at improving their awareness

  • While you are right that cyclists should learn how to use the roads (and could take up free skills training offered by most London Boroughs) . Other people die under the wheels of car drivers. Kids and older pedestrians. The onus is largely on drivers to take more fucking care

    In the UK drivers kill about 2,000-3,000 people more or less each year and 1,000s more are injured
    I suppose rather than asking cyclists how many crashes/near misses they have had a better question would be asking drivers how many they have had.
    We judge road safety by counting the victims not the perps

  • Oh i agree but with drivers not being retested regularly, any change will be a generation to implement and in that more short term solutions are needed as well

  • Isn't cycling getting safer? Statistically.

  • Seriously, was this thread really necessary?

  • Isn't cycling getting safer? Statistically.

    In absolute numbers there has been a rise. In terms of per mile traveled/rate base stats, considering the increased number of riders it is probably less risky (though according to TRL it's twice as risky here than in the Netherlands/Sweden)

    Seriously, was this thread really necessary?

    The forum people will decide this

  • List?

  • but is the answer (apart from better road design..) more training for cyclists, or more training/discipline for the people who are bringing the source of the danger on to the roads?

  • all 3, why does an action have to exclusive to the other 2

  • Enforcement is crucial whether by camera, black boxes in cars, Lorries, buses, spot checks by police. (and less time wasted of stopping rljing pavement cycling- wrong target)
    And proper punishment for offenders
    Road crime is crime

    ... and all the other stuff

  • Who teaches young riders to 'hug the kerb'? How many younger riders have ever had any form of cycle training?

    People behaving like morons is the issue, either driver or rider, no one group is solely to blame.

  • Drivers behaving badly kill and injure other people. Many others. Cyclists (and peds ) do not. You^ are blaming victims

  • Have you ever seen the calling out bad cyclists thread? You seem to live in a world of us and them where every driver is a homicidal maniac and cyclists are bunny hugging do-gooders.

    Do you drive, skydancer?

  • Who teaches young riders to 'hug the kerb'?

    Everyone, from the narrow cycle lane saying it's safe to undertake all the time to the imitating drivers who shout at you for being on the road.

  • Have you ever seen the calling out bad cyclists thread? You seem to live in a world of us and them where every driver is a homicidal maniac and cyclists are bunny hugging do-gooders.

    Do you drive, skydancer?

    I can drive and have driven though not recently
    To some extent you are right re us ie people out of cars who may get harmed by them, people in cars who don't care enough to to look after us.

    So they turn without checking
    They natter on their phones
    They speed
    They pass close
    They hoot and deny walkers their right to cross roads
    The beep cyclists into the gutter
    I could go on...

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Blood on the streets

Posted by Avatar for skydancer @skydancer