Visual Aids for Cycle Training

Posted on
Page
of 3
/ 3
Last Next
  • Basically a do and don't of cycling, skydancer pitch the idea that we should have a topic featuring video of common scenario in cycling.

  • Nice one Ed. Maybe people who have posted vids in other threads could post them here now? I'm sure there is a way of doing it as a moderator but I will leave be for now.

  • press some buttons please do

  • So lets start with the important stuff:
    Bikeability level 1.x
    YouTube - How to Skid and Track Stand on a Fixie

  • Oh i get it...when you said visual AIDS i thought......never mind.

  • Looks like the cyclist has got right of way, and the driver considering turning across then stops. Cyclist doing the filming was correct to slow anticipating the possible turn, but should then have rolled through once it was clear the car wasn't actually going to turn across (eye contact with driver, then acknowledgement etc etc). Looks like filming cyclist almost gets rear-ended by another rider as a result of stopping?

    Maybe I'm being thick and missing something, so off to bed to listen to cricket and will catch up tomorrow.

  • Defective left-hook design bus lane. Defective bike lane within the bus lane. Defective cyclist positioning.

  • Looks like the cyclist has got right of way, and the driver considering turning across then stops. Cyclist doing the filming was correct to slow anticipating the possible turn, but should then have rolled through once it was clear the car wasn't actually going to turn across (eye contact with driver, then acknowledgement etc etc). Looks like filming cyclist almost gets rear-ended by another rider as a result of stopping?

    Maybe I'm being thick and missing something, so off to bed to listen to cricket and will catch up tomorrow.

    The cyclists proceeding along the bus lane do have priority over turning traffic, but you learn quickly to cede priority in bus lanes. Rolling through after eye-contact is no guarantee that a vehicle will not swipe you. In the same situation, I'd wait again.

    Yes, the rider behind (who makes the hand gesture) was not watching how the situation was developing ahead of him and nearly rear-ended me. I sometimes shout "slowing" in these circumstances (or use club hand gestures if there's a somebody drafting) but the guy was not even close when I looked back before the junction.

  • I sometimes shout "slowing" in these circumstances (or use club hand gestures if there's a somebody drafting) but the guy was not even close when I looked back before the junction.

    Those sort of stuff I'd advised not to do, while you have good intention of doing that, the last thing you want is to people to end up automatically assuming that the next person will do the same thing and end up rear-ending them because they did not do the hand signal/shout a warning.

    My only advice is that he should simply give a bit more braking room and always be prepared to stop at all time, rather than expecting someone to warn him.

  • The cyclists proceeding along the bus lane do have priority over turning traffic, but you learn quickly to cede priority in bus lanes. Rolling through after eye-contact is no guarantee that a vehicle will not swipe you. In the same situation, I'd wait again.

    Yes, the rider behind (who makes the hand gesture) was not watching how the situation was developing ahead of him and nearly rear-ended me. I sometimes shout "slowing" in these circumstances (or use club hand gestures if there's a somebody drafting) but the guy was not even close when I looked back before the junction.

    There's no guarantees that you won't ever be hit in any circumstance, but stopping and giving way to drivers in this scenario sends them (and those cycling around you) mixed messages - what if it's not you they meet next time and they turn across a rider who was understandably expecting the right of way?

    I don't think your video is showing best practice in this case.

    Happy to be corrected by those with better knowledge of the National Cycling Standard. Slowing to confirm safety (eye contact) and then proceeding with right of way is what i'd teach.

  • There's no guarantees that you won't ever be hit in any circumstance, but stopping and giving way to drivers in this scenario sends them (and those cycling around you) mixed messages - what if it's not you they meet next time and they turn across a rider who was understandably expecting the right of way?

    I don't think your video is showing best practice in this case.

    Happy to be corrected by those with better knowledge of the National Cycling Standard. Slowing to confirm safety (eye contact) and then proceeding with right of way is what i'd teach.

    Thanks for the comments.

    What we're talking about here is trying to mitigate different and competing risks. In dynamic traffic situations you have to consider (amongst other things) risk exposure. I certainly think eye-contact is a useful aid, but the driver did not look directly at me even though I was focussed on them.

    Waiting does send mixed messages (the positve message is that it primes other cyclists to the danger of gaps in queuing traffic at junctions), but to be honest, I'm more concerned about a) enjoying myself and b) avoiding injury when I'm riding. If I can set an example, I try, but it's more likely that others can learn from my mistakes.

    Was I cautious, or overly cautious in the vid? I'm not sure. Watch the car on my right, it moves to proceed (as you have suggested), but then the van turns across his path into the junction.

    In addition, drivers often flash other drivers through in this scenario and a driver turning across the bus lane ocassionally abnegates his/her responsibility to look and continue only if it is clear.

    The vid is certainly not supposed to be an example of "best practice" - it's a messy, real world scenario where you're trying to weigh up what is essentially a risk matrix on the fly.

  • I think you should ask why the cars move as though to proceed? Having seen a cyclist has stopped, as you did, then that's a clear signal to them to go.

    It could be argued that you were overlycautious in that situation, thus actually creating some of the risks via your actions, which you then use to justify your initial stopping. Key to me is the video is called 'defensive' rather than 'assertive'.

    I agree it's all a huge risk assessment exercise on the fly, we're all doing this daily.

    Keep safe, keep having fun :)

  • I think you should ask why the cars move as though to proceed? Having seen a cyclist has stopped, as you did, then that's a clear signal to them to go.

    It could be argued that you were overlycautious in that situation, thus actually creating some of the risks via your actions, which you then use to justify your initial stopping. Key to me is the video is called 'defensive' rather than 'assertive'.

    I agree it's all a huge risk assessment exercise on the fly, we're all doing this daily.

    Keep safe, keep having fun :)

    Watch closely, I was talking about the car to my right that tries to proceed forward after it has stopped, but the van turns into the junction.

    Overly cautious - quite possibly. In this scenario the risk of more serious injury is presented by the car, IMO, not a cyclist colliding with me from behind. To me, that's playing the odds in favour of avoiding a more dangerous outcome. Does it increase the likelihood of a rear-ending - yes, but that I can live with.

    Take it easy.

  • In this situation, the cyclists hasn't much choice but to stop as well, if you see a car stopped or slowed down, or hasn't moved yet for (what appear to be) no reason, take caution, it might be letting an old bidden cross the road, car turning from a junction, using the phone etc.

  • Watch closely, I was talking about the car to my right that tries to proceed forward after it has stopped, but the van turns into the junction.

    Overly cautious - quite possibly. In this scenario the risk of more serious injury is presented by the car, IMO, not a cyclist colliding with me from behind. To me, that's playing the odds in favour of avoiding a more dangerous outcome. Does it increase the likelihood of a rear-ending - yes, but that I can live with.

    Take it easy.

    Ok, I was referring to the traffic waiting to turn so crossed wires, even so....

    Given that you first stopped for the hesitant silver car (infront of the van) you could've been long gone before the van attempts to turn. Yes it's dangerous, yes it's something to look out for, but that part of the incident is a follow on to the fact that you had stopped in the first place.

    I wasn't there, I can't see fully what you could see, as am watching a fixed view from the comfort of my keyboard warrior chair. With that in mind I can appreciate why you took the "real world" action you did even if I don't agree that it was the best option on the video replay. edit - Good to discuss it and keep thinking over these scenarios though. I watched all your similar vids, and the scenarios you're capturing are good.

  • I remember that section.

    another example of how primary position prevent such collision by giving yourself a lots of room between the kerbs and your bike - more room to manoeuvre.

  • Swept path of HGV at traffic lights:

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PsMml2wqB­os"]YouTube

    - HGV Turning Circle: Left Turn - Defensive Cycling 11![/ame]

  • Not cautious enough...?

    YouTube - Bus Lane, Cycle Lane and a Junction 3 - Defensive Cycling 10!

    The cyclist in this vid roughly matching the speed of other traffic should be in the primary position in the normal traffic lane. Traveling in tandem is always safest and side-by-side traveling should be justified by meaninigful increase in convenience to car driver/cyclist by overtaking/filtering.

  • The cyclist in this vid roughly matching the speed of other traffic should be in the primary position in the normal traffic lane. Traveling in tandem is always safest and side-by-side traveling should be justified by meaninigful increase in convenience to car driver/cyclist by overtaking/filtering.

    A bus/cycle lane and traffic lane merge into a wider traffic lane and cycle lane on the approach to the lights. However, you will note the cycle lane has no mandatory or advisory markings (effectively meaning there are two de facto traffic lanes in most road users' eyes). This should have alerted me to a potential problem.

    The point about being part of the traffic stream where possible is well made if you can maintain that speed (as you will see I was hanging back behind the 4x4) **until **I tried to proceed as the de facto lane was clear. If I had been 6 feet further over I would be behind cars wanting to turn right after the lights and I would then have to merge back to the left as the bus lane recommences after the traffic lights. It might have helped in this particular instance. HHowever, the major disadvantage of trying to maintain the position you are advocating in the moving traffic lane is that you get cars undertaking at speed wanting to turn left like the 4x4 or trying to overtake. This doubles the threat and leaves you exposed in what is, to all intents and purposes, a wide traffic lane that two motorised vehicles use all the time.

    In the same situation, I would simply have slowed until I had passed the junction (less convenient, but potentially, lower risk as the threat is now from a rear ending).

  • excellent chainwhip, highlighting the hazards of segregated cycle lines and to such a funky soundtrack

  • I don't even need to understand spanish to get the point of that video, great little example.

    Just ask the person who uploaded that video if he can do an english subtitled one.

  • Post a reply
    • Bold
    • Italics
    • Link
    • Image
    • List
    • Quote
    • code
    • Preview
About

Visual Aids for Cycle Training

Posted by Avatar for edscoble @edscoble

Actions