Frame geometry/sizing question

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  • This month's paycheck is going on a new frame, one with track ends. I've been riding a conversion and I'm quite intimidated by talk of track geometry being twitchy, harder to ride, toe overlap etc.

    For this reason I've looked at frames designed for street riding. But the IRO V, Pake et al aren't available in the UK and the only frame I can find with a more relaxed geometry than track is the Surly Steamroller. It seems a good frame and I'll probably got for it but I do have some reservations: it's pretty ugly with those wiggly rear stays and the poo brown colour it comes in. Does anyone know of any other frames designed for fixed but with more road like geometry?

    Or should I just stop being a wuss and get a track frame? How different is the riding, and how much less comfortable? What are your experiences moving from road to track frames. I'm thinking Bob Jackson here... but Jos, Roberto and Brick Lane Bikes have plenty to choose from.

  • You can always get the Surly frame painted.
    Mine is at the paint shop as I type, to shortly return a lurid green:

    *image for illustration purposes only.

  • Lots of people ride track frames on the road without any problems. I bloody love mine and couldn't imagine riding anything less responsive. Obviously geometry, material etc varies wildly but lots of 'em can pull double duty.

    I think Surlys are alright, but you're not far off the price of a Bob Jackson or Mercian and definitely below price of a really nice 2nd hand frame (Bricklane, Jos, Ebay etc.)

  • Pearson is out of the same Taiwanese pot as the Dolan.

    Price difference between a Surly and a Jackson/Witcomb/Mercian isn't as much as you might expect, and you can choose your geometry (or more accurately the builder will advise you).

    The waiting sucks out loud, though...

  • ffub Or should I just stop being a wuss and get a track frame? How different is the riding, and how much less comfortable? What are your experiences moving from road to track frames. I'm thinking Bob Jackson here... but Jos, Roberto and Brick Lane Bikes have plenty to choose from.

    You could do that...you'll be fine if you've been riding with a fixed for a while.
    The difference you'll feel is that you'll be riding higher from the road and the steering is significantly incresed in responsiveness.
    You'll have more weight on your front wheel and since steering is so easy toe overlap should only warry you when you're makin about or trackstanding, but you'll easily adapt to that.

  • I've recently changed the gearing on my conversion, a 1963 Carlton frame.
    While doing this I tried to get the rear wheel further forward in the dropouts which slope at about 30 degrees.

    This effective shortening of the back-end by about 15mm has made a big difference to the handling, the front end seems more twitchy and seems to wobble when I take hands off the bars (I know, you're thinking if I didn't do that i wouldn't have a problem!). So I guess because of the angled dropouts this has now steepened the head tube too.

    The stem is only 90mm and I understand about Rake and Trail, but I never expected such a pronounced difference from a small change, anyone else experienced this before?

    I know track frames have horizontal dropouts so there is no geometry change, but how twitchy is an average track frame compared to a road frame?

  • my dave yates track frame, has a really really short wheelbase; it's really nimble though and can turn by just leaning.

  • http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicycle_and­_motorcycle_geometry is quite a good article but I am not sure how much it help with you question.

    dogsballs it's really nimble though and can turn by just leaning.

    No it can't.

  • Is the back wheel aligned properly?

  • fc9k Is the back wheel aligned properly?

    Yeah, it's straight as a die.

    At first I though my front wheel was loose because it felt twitchy, but everything is tight and straight.

  • I have just made up a new fixed wheel. Different to my old one as it is using a track frame. This new bike has a bit more drop from saddle to bars than I've got on my converted road bike SS. The distance between saddle and bars is the same. Basically the issue is it still seems comfortable despite the extra drop!

    Is that because the track frame angles are a little steeper and therefore my upper body is a little further forward?

  • yup. and also a higher b/b.

  • yup. and also a higher b/b.

    glad I have a 58 and not a 60 like normal. my nuts wouldn't be able to take it!

  • i'm the same would normally ride a 56, but my 54 seems just right.

  • Hi guys,

    Need some help with a pair of Specialized Body Geometry shoes that I have. I don't know what they are called but the ratchety things with the little handle to get them really tight is worn out on both sides. When I bought them there was something in the the instructions inside the box that said that these parts could be replaced but as I've chucked the box I don't know what they're called.

    The rest of the shoes are in pretty good nick for two years of fairly constant use in all weathers so rather than get new ones I'd like to try and find replacement parts if I can. So if anyone knows what these parts are called or where I could find them please let me know. I've been Googling away but to no avail.

    Thanks in advance.

  • If you can't find anywhere that sells them, email specialized directly and ask them politely for some.

  • Condor might be able to get them for you. In the leaflets with my spesh shoes, which I bought at Condor, it says to just contact your dealer for replacement parts.

  • Cheers guys. I think I did buy them from Condor so I'll ask them if they can help and I'll e-mail Specialized directly as well.

  • Cyclefit sell them new, you could see if they have spares.

  • Bike geometry

    Has anybody got any websites or info on bike geometry
    Ive got and idea in the making to build a frame, or a couple
    How would I go about getting the perfect sizing for me
    cheers

  • Look up Jobst Brandt & Mike Burrows, they have both written substantially about it. The former more traditional, the latter more experimental.

  • Hi, let's say we have two frames with top tube lengths of 56cm and 58cm respectively.

    That doesn't necessarily mean that the larger frame will only be 2cm longer along the top tube, does it, as the seat tube will be longer too, which probably gives a resultant increase of more than 2cm along the top tube compared to the 56cm frame, right?

    I'm just wondering if a 58cm top tube frame may be a bit too large for me.

    Thoughts? Thx.

  • Hi, let's say we have two frames with top tube lengths of 56cm and 58cm respectively.

    That doesn't necessarily mean that the larger frame will only be 2cm longer along the top tube, does it.

    well 58 - 56 = 2 so yes.

    If the top tubes are not horizontal, then the effective top tube lengths may not vary by the 2cm if the angles are different.

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Frame geometry/sizing question

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