Bike fit / correct riding position

Re. Optilabs, I got them to put prescription lenses in some Oakley Straight Jackets got for cheaps on Ebay and they can do heavier prescriptions than Oakley can do with their lenses.
Optilabs correction on the lenses to adjust for the wrap around effect is really good so you don't get a fishbowl effect.

Incidentally I have similar discovery when switching from standard Brooks B17 to the Selle Anatomica with the cut out.

Conjecture (and a CSB) but I normally get neck pain on any ride above ~50 miles.

It's normally the right hand side of my neck- not from being bent over low, but from not having a straight spine.

I'd put this down to ideopathic scoliosis, and decided to a) do lots of planks and b) try to HTFU.

However, last week I rode a hire bike that had a saddle with a channel down the middle.

Not only did I have no neck pain, I also had zero lower back pain.

I'm wondering now whether I was sitting to one side on my saddle, leading to the whole curvy spine thing.

What does your physio say? I'd say it was the Cam

Conjecture (and a CSB) but I normally get neck pain on any ride above ~50 miles.

It's normally the right hand side of my neck- not from being bent over low, but from not having a straight spine.

I'd put this down to ideopathic scoliosis, and decided to a) do lots of planks and b) try to HTFU.

However, last week I rode a hire bike that had a saddle with a channel down the middle.

Not only did I have no neck pain, I also had zero lower back pain.

I'm wondering now whether I was sitting to one side on my saddle, leading to the whole curvy spine thing.

What does your physio say? I'd say it was the Campagnolo shifters and you now have to bite the financial bullet and get these on all your bikes.

Re. Optilabs, I got them to put prescription lenses in some Oakley Straight Jackets got for cheaps on Ebay and they can do heavier prescriptions than Oakley can do with their lenses.
Optilabs correction on the lenses to adjust for the wrap around effect is really good so you don't get a fishbowl effect.

OK I am confused; I did a 60 odd mile ride today and had the specs related pain; I have a 250k audax next weekend and sorting this is crucial; Since its late/expensive to get Oakley prescriptions and I really didnt like optilabs own products; I have following options.

1. Get contact lenses and some cheap cycling sunglasses only thing is I have NEVER use contact lenses. I don't know if I have enough time to get and get used to them by Sunday

2. Fold and get £300-sh for RX sport half jackets again no idea if they'll get delivered

1. get one of those trainspotter straps; not sure if they'll work with my specs
   

1. Get contact lenses and some cheap cycling sunglasses only thing is I have NEVER use contact lenses. I don't know if I have enough time to get and get used to them by Sunday
   
   

You'll be fine with soft lenses, hard lenses are pretty uncomfortable.

Riddle me this, Internet bike-fitters.

According to Peter White and other sources upon the Internet if you have pains in your neck and shoulders this is because you are trying to support your upper body and either (or both) your core strength is insufficient to the task, or your saddle is too far forward relative to the pedals.

Taking the second part first - the point that Peter makes is that your seat needs to be some way behind the BB in order to balance your upper body, if it's too far forward then you would topple forward without your arms to arrest your fall, no matter how strong your core.

I've suffered from neck pain for years, this year I've made a real effort to stop hunching my shoulders up round my ears, and this helps.

I've also found that being on the drops for an entire ride= zero neck pain.

When I was in France a couple of weeks ago I was in the drops ~95% of the time, did a decent amount of riding and had no neck pain at all.

Come back to the UK, first commute (100% in the hoods) neck pain again.

I am starting to think that the reason for this is that when I am lower at the front my body is balanced, so I'm not supporting my upper body with my arms, and no pain.

Therefore, if I move my saddle back a bit (and probably dropped the bars a little) I might be able to move the balance point so that I am not supporting my upper body with my arms when commuting?

Or is that all crazy talk?

commute in the drops

Build a lopro with bulls and commute on it :P

Ride on the hoods or drops and then take hands off the bars. If you collapse in a heap start planking. Your arms should ideally just be steering with no supporting of your upper body required until last couple of hours of bullshit like the Dunwich Dynamo.

Last week I saw a traithenger in Richmond Park, his hips were all over the place and both knees were describing a 3d figure 8 and he was grinding away.

I caught up with him and suggested he needed a bike fit. From where I was it appeared he had fitted himself in the mirror to get a flat back with no consideration for his actual ability to pedal. He told me he'd seen the best fitter in the country at freespeed and knew his fit was perfect. I said it had been painful to watch him riding as he contorted himself up the incline from Kingston to Richmond gates. I suggested he might like to try using a more comfortable gear and was told that he knew what he was doing, it was at that point I noticed he was not just on the 11 tooth sprocket, but was also in the big ring!

All I could do was agree that he clearly knew what he was doing and leave him to further destroy his body.

tl;dr

triathlete was clueless

Riddle me this, Internet bike-fitters.

According to Peter White and other sources upon the Internet if you have pains in your neck and shoulders this is because you are trying to support your upper body and either (or both) your core strength is insufficient to the task, or your saddle is too far forward relative to the pedals.

Taking the second part first - the point that Peter makes is that your seat needs to be some way behind the BB in order to balance your upper body, if it's too far forward then you would topple forward without your arms to arrest your fall, no matter how strong your core.

I've suffered from neck pain for years, this year I've made a real effort to stop hunching my shoulders up round my ears, and this helps.

I've also found that being on the drops for an entire ride= zero neck pain.

When I was in France a couple of weeks ago I was in the drops ~95% of the time, did a decent amount of riding and had no neck pain at all.

Come back to the UK, first commute (100% in the hoods) neck pain again.

I am starting to think that the reason for this is that when I am lower at the front my body is balanced, so I'm not supporting my upper body with my arms, and no pain.

Therefore, if I move my saddle back a bit (and probably dropped the bars a little) I might be able to move the balance point so that I am not supporting my upper body with my arms when commuting?

Or is that all crazy talk?
I'm surprised you support your upper body with your arms. Is that something you try to do, so you have some arm muscle?

As adoubletap says, I'd be aiming to relieve the weight taken by your arms which in turn tightens up the back, shoulders and around the neck without us even realising. One thing I'm much more aware of since starting yoga is how high my shoulder blades can become - but when I drop them down, regardless of my angle, riding is more comfortable. I also mainly steer with my hips not my hands - horse-riding school paid off ;)

I hope you figure out the cause and get it sorted soon!

Ride on the hoods or drops and then take hands off the bars. If you collapse in a heap start planking. Your arms should ideally just be steering with no supporting of your upper body required until last couple of hours of bullshit like the Dunwich Dynamo.

This.

Currently, my saddle is set quite far forward compare to most people on here, but I can comfortably ride in a drop position without my hand on the handlebar.

The very simple test I learnt from Scherrit is a great way of visualising how the bike fit without bringing out all kind of measuring jango like most other bike fitter do.

As I said, Ed, I can ride in the drops with no load on my hands, it's when I try to "sit up" and ride on the hoods that my arms load up.

I concur. The Steve Hogg thing I read was to get on a turbo, cycle at tempo pace or so and throw your arms behind you. If you can't hold the position comfortably, move the saddle back. Worked for me.

I did some (very. very basic) testing on the way in this morning to determine "balance point".

At ~325 watts I'm perfectly balanced with no weight on my hands, above ~450 I'm holding onto the bars as my torso lifts, and below 250 I've got weight on my hands.

Cruising along in traffic is ~150 watts, and there is enough load on my hands to be annoying- unless I go down onto the drops when it's fine, but then visibility is slightly compromised.

I dont really understand how moving down into the drops, can relieve the weight on Your hands.

Unless you move back and Down. I know I end up With my butt further back in the saddle when I move into the drops.

Which kinda gives you your answer.

Is riding bent forward likely to add stress to your hamstrings?

I have around a 11cm saddle to bar drop. Which is a lot for a short guy. Never been a problem. In fact I find I get a better Balance of weight distribution. I chucked some aero extensions on which have me even lower at the front, and last ride my hamstrings suffered. Getting some thicker pads, and then possibly some spacers. Plus the extensions arent going to used in any of the races I have coming up. They're just for big solo rides. So no biggie.

It's a little hard to explain, but it feels like I am at a more "natural" angle when I am lower- this could of course simply be a sign that I have almost no core strength whatsoever, and when low enough I'm being supported by my compressed organs.

Neil I had (kind of still have) the same issue. And I am still most comfortable (neck) when I am in drops.

After scheritt I realised few things

1. My saddle was too up front hence no bend in elbows and too much weight on hands/neck

2. Because of my glasses I was bending my neck even more than required

3. I was hunching vs bending my lower back

After a 250+k in saddle yesterday of course I had pain but it was as much as I used to get after 50k in the past. For first at least 100k I was consciously trying to be in the 'ideal' position (lower back bend vs hunching). I was using all 3 bar positions. I used contact lenses and oakleys which helped a LOT to keep my neck in the right position; again this was something I had to do consciously due to old habit.

Scheritt did conduct (asked me to conduct on open road safely) the test that Ed mentioned and that would quickly recognise the faults.

Is riding bent forward likely to add stress to your hamstrings?

I have around a 11cm saddle to bar drop. Which is a lot for a short guy. Never been a problem. In fact I find I get a better Balance of weight distribution. I chucked some aero extensions on which have me even lower at the front, and last ride my hamstrings suffered. Getting some thicker pads, and then possibly some spacers. Plus the extensions arent going to used in any of the races I have coming up. They're just for big solo rides. So no biggie.

I would check if you want to use the aerobars for styrkeprøven, I was always under the impression they're not allowed.

I dont really understand how moving down into the drops, can relieve the weight on Your hands.

Less reach in the drop than in the hood perhaps?

Nope, not for me anyway.

I would check if you want to use the aerobars for styrkeprøven, I was always under the impression they're not allowed.

Nope not allowed.

I bought them pretty cheaply, and enjoy using them, so no bother.

But every other ride I've entered here states clearly no aero Extensions. Styrkeprøven assumes my lazy arse would read the National rules for a 'turritt'. Which of course I didnt untill after they arrived.

Less reach in the drop than in the hood perhaps?

This was my thought. Certainly the case on my bike.

Nope, not for me anyway.

OK.