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  • From a linguistic perspective, there is (still) no equivalent of all the usual abusive epithets for white people that's genuinely insulting (not that I'm suggesting there should be, as eliminating the others from usage would do just fine), so that someone being abused with the n-word or the P-word can't reply in kind. In the video, he tries 'wasteman' (and obviously may not intend to reply in kind), but that's a much weaker insult. Basically, if a racist uses the above words, or others of the same kind, they can assert a position of 'power'/feel powerful just because verbally, they're not going to get the same back (you can see this as the racist tries to pretend that everything is perfectly 'normal' after the insult, daintily playing with his phone).

    Needless to say, also, no-one is going to succeed in arguing the case against in a situation like that. While there are laws against hate speech, and people can, in theory and sometimes in practice, be hauled before a court, that's indirect, work-intensive, and will never cover all the actual instances of verbal racist abuse (when there is also more serious physical violence to be dealt with in this way, or issues like discrimination in the workplace).

  • What would help personally?

    A lower burden of proof that POC felt threatened for their safety whilst the abuse was happening.

    A white person to say they also felt their safety was threatened and abuser swung at me first and I reacted in self defence and then be prepared to reflect this in a statement.

    Apart from white peoples actually doing the punching on my behalf (Cos you know we’re gonna get punished harder and longer and more brutally than you might be at every single stage of the justice process- You can literally get away with murder) this is what being an actual ally would look like. Any other response and you’re flexing that privilege.

  • One can be pretty damn insulting without bringing race into it though.

    "Mummy hating dog rapist" usually hits the nail on the head.

  • Yes, but so what? Even if any of the components of such an insult are true or truish, you have to know the person you're insulting to make them cut. If you don't know the person, they don't cut in the same way because they don't revolve around something so obvious, and therefore knowingly insultable, as superficial aspects of a person's relatively recent ancestry and heritage, which the racist insult implies are somehow bad or something to be ashamed of. Something non-obvious or untrue that you don't actually know of a person can always be denied or shrugged off, or, as in the present example, simply returned--'no, you're the wasteman'. The racist insult will still be there and unanswered.

    An equivalent kind of insult to racist insults for the majority group, which in most contexts where racist insults are made, simply doesn't exist, as they are historically connected to victimisation of minority groups, making them doubly hurtful.

  • My mate got called Dave once by a group of Asian lads "alright then Dave, on your way Dave, see you later Dave" , I thought it was as hilarious as they did (especially as I wasn't even with one of my many white friends called Dave) but it does kinda point out the difference in language and privilege related to it around this part (and it's related colonial parts) of the world.

  • don't go around calling people racial slurs and you won't get punched for calling people racial slurs.

    it doesn't really upset me if bad things happen to people who can't obey that maxim.

  • But what if I'm just saying it because it's short for Pakistani and that's what my mum used to call her friend at the end of the road 50 years ago and they didn't publicly speak up about it in front of the fully white and openly racist rest of the street back then and took it as just a bit of banter not just to avoid getting beaten up or anything?

  • i had a mate working in China-he grew up in Hong Kong so actually speaks decent Chinese-he was shocked how racist the Chinese were to him thinking that he couldn't understand them. Apparently one of the favourites is to call Westerners 'stupid pink pig' while smiling and pretending to say hello. Think they were bemused when they got told to fuck themselves.

    Calling white people Dave is just taking it too far though.

  • I dunno. Old people can be genuinely just daft/don't intend it to harm even if it does.

    Other cunts just look to rile. Absolutely hate people saying 'Jock' or 'Scotch' as they fucking well mean to be derogatory, so more than willing to accept that Chinese and Asians might feel the same about so-called 'abbreviations' to their nationalities.

    In terms of power dynamics, we've got Taffs for Welsh, Jocks for Scots, Micks for Irish. What's the abbreviation for English? Thought 'Tommy' but I checked and it's British soldier? It really hadn't even occurred to me to think about it till now.

  • Don't need derogatory nicknames for the ones in charge. ENGGUURLAAAND!

  • Micks for Irish

    My parents were pretty unimaginative.

  • I’d never seen this one before. A joy to behold.

  • Dynamite hook that. Proper.

  • "alright then Dave, on your way Dave, see you later Dave"

    Thats what I say to shitty cab drivers when they don't give me space or cut in front of me in a proper cockney accent

  • ha. are you actually a Michael though?

    I've genuinely never met any Scot called Jock. Or any Dafyds for that matter. Parents would need to be a bit cuntish to do it these days I guess.

  • I knew a Dafyd at school, fucking Kazak prick.

  • In terms of power dynamics, we've got Taffs for Welsh, Jocks for Scots, Micks for Irish. What's the abbreviation for English? Thought 'Tommy' but I checked and it's British soldier? It really hadn't even occurred to me to think about it till now.

    Poms ?

  • That's just the rambling of ex cons.

  • I think most of the world doesn't need an actual word for the English, it's just an expression somewhere between missing out on the last sourdough loaf and realising the fart you can smell is your own but you didn't realise you did it and might need a wipe to double check everything is OK.

  • Roast beefs. English people often get called 'röst bief!', and apparently the German term for British people (including Scots, Welsh and N.I.) is 'Inselafen', literally translated as 'islands apes'. On the other hand we call them by their words for cabbage, which isn't so creative.

  • I am indeed! In my class of 24 in school, there were 4 Michaels.

    In fact at my first forum drinks there was a conversation between the guy who brought me along and one of the other regulars that went along the lines of:

    1: "Who's that you brought with you?"
    2: "Some Irish guy from uni, can't remember his name"
    1: "It's probably Paddy or Mick or something. Hey Mick!"

    Granted I don't find the terms offensive, but if you know someone's intentionally trying to wind you up by saying it, that's a different story.

  • Roast beefs. English people often get called 'röst bief!', and apparently the German term for British people (including Scots, Welsh and N.I.) is 'Inselafen', literally translated as 'islands apes'. On the other hand we call them by their words for cabbage, which isn't so creative.

    The French term is 'rosbifs'.

    https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/rosbif

    I've never heard the term "Inselaffe(n)" in Germany. Apparently, it was mostly used in the British Zone, where I've hardly ever been. In earlier times, e.g. the First World War, people said "Tommy(s)".

    Also, "Kraut" isn't the German word for cabbage--that's "Kohl". It does occur in some older combinations like the well-known "Sauerkraut", and of course the English loan word 'kraut' is derived from that, but in itself "Kraut" just means 'herb' or (green) plant or growth (in some usages), and is present in such set phrases as "ins Kraut schießen", which means 'to go to seed' or, figuratively, 'to run rampant'. The adjective "krautig" is used to refer to the stem, branch, seed, or leaf parts of a plant as opposed to its blossoms or fruit.

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