London Fixed-gear and Single-speed SJS Cycles

Not a lawyer but yes, if you crossed any lines marking a division of carriageways, for what ever reason you are travelling on the wrong side of the road.

It is permitted to travel on the wrong side of the road if you are going to overtake, however you have a legal responsibility to ensure that the carraigeway you are moving into is free of traffic and will be so for the duration of your overtaking manouver. You were supposed to avoid him by making sure your manouver was safe in the first place. The third point may be irrelevant if there was insufficient space to avoid a collision.

As above, seek legal advice before doing anything else.

I had a nasty crash a couple of months ago. It was my fault. I never admitted it and just said I couldn't remember anything because I'd been knocked out. The police just gave me a ticking off and told me to wear a helmet, even though I'd scraped up the side of some guys van and totally wiped out his mirror.

I was dead lucky I was ok (bumps, bruises and slight concussion) and also that I wasn't prosecuted. Just never admit blame in the first instance of an RTC.

Very Useful Infomation. Thanks.

When should you call the police. I have a friend who was hit and knocked off and she didn't call, and I now know she should have. However, what if your not injured? Or your bike is the only one who was hurt? Does it matter if it was an accident or if it was reckless or dangerous driving?

I even have heard of the police telling people who report stolen bikes that they should have called them out to the scene. Is that just the police trying to shift the blame or is it something you should actually do? This whole area of what you have to do in these unfortunate situations is itself a mess.

I agree - there is a lot of confusion with what cyclists should do following an accident.

Although it does not always seem practical at the time, you should always call the police to the scene in the case of an accident, whether you are injured or not.

Cyclists seem to think of themselves as having less rights than other road users and often leave the scene of an accident without taking the other driver's details. My advice is that it is best to think what you would do if you were a car driver. For instance, if your car got stolen or broken into you would call the police to the scene. Or if your car got damaged in an accident you would take down the other person's details and get the police involved. Do the same if you are a cyclist.

i'm not going to come along this evening as i forgot TRNC... but happy to offer services if you need some help to look at transport options to solve the issue. seems like you've enough skills / people attending tonight.

Did you mean to post this in the Action Group thread?

rider down... me

on the harrow road going south on the hill just before the turning for scrubs lane

riding my fixed bike with front brake

i am going down the right hand side of stattic traffic. A women coming from a junction on my left, she was cutting through the stoped traffic, pokes her nose out into the centre of the road

the nature of the hill is steep enough to make it hard to see a gap in traffic or a car pulling out from the left.

so the first i see is of her poking her nose out right in my path i am about 2 meters away i lock my legs and my front brake, but unfrotunatly end up with my front wheel in her wheel arch and me over her bonet

i was not breaking the spead limit i run 44, 16 and was not spinning out so i must have been going below 30

no helmet but i am absolutoly fine brusied jaw and shoulder but my frame now has a bent top tube and down tube and the wheel base is now shortened by an inch or so.

I have the womens number and have contacted her about the broken frame and told her i want to claim it on her insurance.

I also damaged her wheel arch or rim, not sure what she meant was broken over the phone. Can she claim against me, i have no insurance.

Her only witness is her passenger and my only witness is the guy i was riding with.

Was in a bit of a daze so didnt get numbers of passers by etc.

what is the process i go through and was i in the right or the wrong in this situation?

also WANTED NEW FRAME (will be checking classifieds soon)

Sorry to hear about your accident - good thing you are not too badly injured...that could have been really nasty.

In the circumstances you have discribed, the current position in law is that both parties are equally to blame. In other words you would be liable for half the cost of the repairs to her car and she would be liable for half the cost of your injury and bike repairs.

If you were insured then your insurers would pay for her damages and you would still get half of your compensation, so you would still gain. As you are not insured, you would have to pay for 50% of her repair bill personally. As this is the case it is probably not worth you pursuing a claim unless your injury becomes more severe or if the repairs to your bike are worth more than the repairs for her car.

Hope that helps!

ok cheers i think i will leave it as fair and square then she phoned me saying thats what her insurers said aswell, my frame was just a shitty old converted touring frame any way so the value isnt probs as much as the repairs to her car or worth bothering with.

thanks for reading and replying

No problem - happy to help.

C.B., I'm biased, but you can get free third party insurance if you join the LCC (you can also get it through other cycling organisations, I should mention). Saves you money through discounts in bike shops and gives you peace of mind.

http://www.lcc.org.uk/

Glad you're OK and good luck with the outcome!

Oliver
LCC

I don't know if the LCC keeps a close count of reported cycle accidents or anything, but my girlfriend fractured her elbow last night thanks to a dangerous driver.

She was coming down Brixton Hill in the bus lane at a sensible pace (she is a very cautious cyclist), with lights and helmet. He turned onto Brixton Hill from left lane of the roundabout, sped up hill, cut across three lanes without indicating and turned into Baytree road at speed right in front of her - she braked and skidded out, landing in the gutter of Brixton Hill on her left elbow.

There were, unfortunately, no eye witnesses and she didn't manage to get the plates due to the driver's speed. The driver failed to stop - indeed, he reportedly accelerated away.

I presume there is nothing we can therefore 'do' about this assault, except log it as a statistic?

Not much, no. :( Obviously, report to police--it is a personal injury incident and an incidence of aggressive driving. You could log it on the CTC's SMIDSY site when it's launched at the Cycle Show this week.

http://road.cc/content/news/7792-ctc...ign-cycle-show

Even if you don't have that much info, whatever information you do have might help the police to build up a picture.

Hey guys got a quick question...

I was run over, yes actually ended up underneath a car 2 weeks ago as a driver didnt see me on a roundabout, we entered from the same entrance but me first then he just drove into the back of me, me and bike ended up under car up to chest, luckily i am mostly alright, ambulance, police were on scene etc... ended up in hospital for x-rays on foot but ok now.

Bike now totalled, all i want is bike back, rang him up he said he didnt believe it was entirely his fault, i have a witness who states that he drove into back of me.

what are my chances of getting bike back (its worth about £1300)? i am in touch with lawyers through the free legal advice from ctc... and any idea how long this is going to take?

the tube seriously sucks

Ouch, sounds bad, yellowbanana. Glad you weren't hurt worse, it seems to have been a lucky escape!

If you're already in touch with lawyers, let them work on the compensation issue. If he really drove into the back of you on a roundabout, he will have a difficult case to make re: not being at fault. But as I say, let the lawyers sort it out if it can't be resolved amicably. It's worth the expense (especially given the high value of the bike) and saves you a lot of hassle. You probably already know that many of them work on a 'no win, no fee' basis. The main thing you need to do is get a bike shop to certify that the bike is a write-off, perhaps the one where you bought it. Good luck.

Sorry to hear about your girlfriends accident - hope she is recovering okay.

I just thought you should know that there is an organisation called the Motor Insurance Bureau that may be of help. It compensates the victims of road traffic accidents for injury where the driver is uninsured or in a hit and run scenario like this one.

To make a claim through the MIB she will have needed to have reported the accident to the police. Did she do this after the accident?

unfortunately not.

it is quite often the way I suppose - she didn't realise how badly she had hurt herself until a while later, the bike was okay and I just couldn't convince her that a trip to Brixton police station followed by Kings A&E on a wet saturday night was a good idea...

Luckily it has transpired that she managed to fracture her elbow in 'the best way possible' and it should be healed in 2-3 weeks, so she's not too upset. (I, on the other hand, am still seething with rage!)

Thank you both for the information anyway. I'll bear the MIB in mind come the (inevitable) next time...

That junction's covered in covert and non covert CCTV, so there should be some evidence of it somewhere...? Oliver, can you clarify when the police report has to be made - is it too late to do it now?

If you want witnesses, you could ask over on the brixton forums of Urban75. Its full of pleasant curtain twitchers.

As far as I know, the police have to accept reports even if it's very late, although obviously the sooner the better. But I don't know for sure. If anyone is a police officer or lawyer and knows better, please post.

Don't put your hopes up high about CCTV. I think unless it's a fairly new camera, the chances of reading the numberplate of a fast-moving vehicle are very low. Also, most CCTV footage gets deleted fairly quickly, so it may well not exist any more.

For untraced drivers, the MIB require the police to have been notified within 5 days of the accident or as soon as reasonably possible after that (i.e. if you were in hospital for a week following the accident then they may extend the deadline by a few days).

Thanks oliver i am going to be getting a 14 bike company bike and will need insurance so i will look into it then cheers

Sorry to hear about the crash......I'm a lawyer and it’s not my specific field but as a rule:

- Always log with the police (you never know what may subsequently transpire) and the fact you logged it counts
-Take photos of bike and injury and take note of a&e/hospital visit etc. If poss, the photos should have date and time on. Just really need to be meticulous over recording everything.
- Is the area covered by CCTV (we do live in a surveillance state), always worth seeing if the police will check camera if you have precise time etc.

I apologise if some points have been mentioned and of course are not so relevant as the accident is in the past but for the future and others……

Bollocks, just been hit by a left-turning, non indicating driver. I have a few grazes and bruises, and my wheel is pringled. Gonna do a claim on his insurance, I know all the advice says to tell the police, but what do they actually do?

They give you a formal audit trail - which will support you in a claim.

Sadly from what i've found out this week, Lambeth cctv is more than pointless. Even they don't know who reviews it.

HI ALL, PLEASE NOTE,
THIS WAS NEVER MEANT TO BE A "RIDER'S DOWN" THREAD.

PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE:
IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS ABOUT WHAT TO DO IN CASE OF AN ACCIDENT PLEASE READ ALL POSTS. If you still have questions then contact the relevant person (THEY ARE PROBABLY LISTED ON THIS THREAD) and by all means post here what you find out (HELP OTHERS!). If you don't know who the relevant person is, then post the question here (hopefully without your entire accident story).

IF YOU HAVE ANSWERS (not just clever ideas) TO QUESTIONS OR KNOW WHO DOES, PLEASE POST THAT INFO HERE. If it's turning into banter, please take it off this thread, figure out the answer, and post the answer here.

IF YOU HAVE POSTED A "RIDER DOWN" -TYPE POST, PLEASE DELETE IT. IT WEAKENS THE POINT OF THIS THREAD. Those who have been in an accident need to be able to get through this thread easily and efficiently. Please no banter back and forth here, it makes it a huge pain to get through when someone else needs to get through this.

THIS THREAD IS FOR HELPFUL INFO ONLY (make it simple for those who have been in an accident) OR FOR QUESTIONS THAT NO ONE ELSE (and you've tried) HAS BEEN ABLE TO ANSWER.

If you have helpful info or would like to donate your assistance (you're a lawyer, md, cop, emt, etc) to other FGSS members, please post that here.

Apologies, I don't mean to sound horrible, but for this thread to continue to help people it can't be a bunch of mish-mashed stories about accidents. The point is for serious info about what to do, who to call, where to go for help, what to expect, and how to get the most out of the legal system.

I'm happy to answer any civil questions anyone has got - I'm a lawyer and specialise in getting compensation for cyclists who have been involved in accidents.

but i don't seem to have the "privilege" to start a new thread, since i'm not yet an old enough user. where on this forum do you propose that i [& members of a similar status to mine] express this kind of news, so that i can then [if permitted] delete this post?
i agree with you about keeping this thread pure.. as it very informative, but riding past this unfortunately common scenario leads to shock, anger & frustration [& also sadness in this case, since it was fatal], which most of us would feel a need to share.
s

Great thread, really helpful! Thanks!

What to do if you're in a crash
Just some words of wisdom from Norman (who has been knocked off his bike twice)

Put your local police station's phone number on your mobile on speed dial

Know your route so that you can tell the police / ambulance your exact location

If you are injured, phone the police immediately

Note the car registration

Take a photo of the accident showing vehicles in crash positions

Take a photo of the driver (the driver who drove over Norman's front wheel denied he was in the car - said someone stole the car)

Take names and addresses of any witnesses

Contact Cycle Aid 01772 250871 - Norman got around £1200 when he claimed.

Cycle Aid are personal injury solicitors specialising in cycle injury and accident claims. We will act for you on a ‘no win, no fee’ basis giving cutting-edge legal advice to help you make a claim for compensation. We have been involved in many substantial claims involving head injuries, shoulder injuries, spinal injuries, facial injuries, back injuries, knee injuries and other bicycle accident claims

Stop SMIDSY


Stop ‘Sorry Mate, I Didn’t See You’

Because sometimes sorry just isn’t enough.
Bad driving intimidates and harms innocent people. Cyclists and pedestrians are particularly endangered by negligent or aggressive driving because we’re not encased in a few tonnes of metal every time we set out on the roads.
Stop SMIDSY will address how the police, prosecutors, the courts, and the law itself could all do a better job at encouraging people to use the roads in safer and more considerate ways. When we lobby these institutions on your behalf, we need evidence of how they need to improve. That’s where you come in.
Report your story and help make our roads safer

Most of us have experienced bad driving. By creating a place to collect and share these stories, we will build the political will to change how society deals with bad driving.
Get information and advice

If you request help from our lawyers, we will send them the information you have supplied us. They will contact you within seven days if they think they will be able to help.
You can also learn more about the law about bad driving and download some practical tips for dealing with it.


http://www.stop-smidsy.org.uk/

got knocked off my bike today! not badly injured but was massively shocked. in a stupid haze didn't get his number plate or driving license details just got the guys phone number. completely buggered my back wheel up! what a numpty!

but did get £75 quid off him today! for a new wheel, which only cost me 30!!!

Hi there

I'm a new member and used to work as a Personal Injury lawyer. I suppose I should qualify that by saying that this was about 6 years ago now and although I have checked up on some of the following info, it shouldn't be taken as a substitute for quality legal advice (you can see the lawyer coming through right there eh?)

I don't have much to add with regard to what to do in the immediate aftermath of an accident. What has gone before is all sound advice. It is possibly worth emphasising the need to involve the police at some point. Often they won't wish to become involved if there is no injury and only property damage. You should report nonetheless since an injury may not become apparent until later on. Also, if the driver was uninsured or becomes untraceable then you will need a crime reference number in order to be able to pursue a claim through the Motor Insurer's Bureau. It is worth knowing too that the date on which you made the report needs to be very close to the actual date of the accident - a bit difficult if you are rendered unconscious of course though in that case, you would hope that the police have become involved anyway. Regardless, get the police involved if you can (assuming the driver is at fault) and get a crime reference number.

Secondly, make sure that if you have been injured that you get a contemporaneous record of your injury by visiting the Dr/hospital as soon as you are aware of any injury. Without proof that your injuries were caused by the accident, you will not be able to recover compensation for them. Bear in mind that sometimes injury isn't immediately apparent or at least that the seriousness of an injury may not be obvious especially when adrenalin is coursing through the system.

It is usually worth instructing a solicitor to pursue a claim for compensation. In fact, I would say that you have nothing to lose in at least having a preliminary discussion with a solicitor. That said, if your injuries are fairly minor (eg stiffness and bruising that doesn't last more than a few weeks with no ongoing problems) then you may struggle to persuade a solicitor to take on your case. This is because the likely value of compensation is less than a thousand pounds which means that the claim falls to be dealt with in the Small Claims court where your solicitor would not be able to recover costs meaning that you would be charged - possibly more than you have won in damages. The same would apply to a claim for property damage only - that is unless you have sustained more than 5000 pounds worth of property damage and loss which is unlikely eh?

You can easily pursue your own claim in the Small Claims court however. The court staff at your local County Court can advise you on the procedure involved but cannot provide legal advice. If your opponent's insurers won't settle then you and your opponent will have the opportunity to put your argument to a District Judge in his office (chambers) which is a fairly informal setting. If you lose, the costs to you will be only minimal - court fees etc. It is still worth getting a preliminary opinion from a solicitor nonetheless - they will tell you whether it is worth insturcting them or not.

Most personal injury solicitors nowadays will carry out an initial assessment of your case for no cost. If they feel there is a reasonable prospect of recovering compensation they will likely agree to handle your case on a no win - no fee basis. This means there is no cost to you and they will be paid by your opponents insurers if the claim is successful. If not, they don't get paid so they have a lot invested in your claim too(though (for a lawyer at least) it always used to be a bit distasteful to say that being paid was a lawyer's primary motivator). Also, bear in mind that you may have legal expenses insurance under an existing policy of insurance - for example household contents, and your insurers will probably wish to instruct solicitors for you.

apil.org.uk is the website for a not for profit organisation called the Association for Personal Injury Lawyers. This is a good resource for finding a specialist solicitor that can help with your case. There are a number of specialists in cycle accidents and (heaven forbid) in the case of serious injuries you may need to look for solicitors with that particular expertise eg catastrophic injuries and/or head injuries.

Other things - keep receipts for bikes and bits etc so that you can prove the cost of them. Keep a note (and receipts) of all expenses you incur as a because of the accident - eg bus/taxi fares, tablets, bandages etc. If you lost earnings as a result, your solicitor will wish to write to your employer to obtain details.

Hope this is of some assistance. Happy to help with other stuff if I can though as I have said, it is usually well worth speaking to a solicitor fairly soon after the accident. Lastly, you have three years from the date of the accident to commence court proceedings. If court proceedings haven't been issued before then, your claim cannot proceed (except in some very limited circumstances). That is to say that there is quite a bit of work that will need to be done before court proceedings are issued and you may struggle to persuade a solicitor to take your case on if limitation is approaching. The sooner you get on to it the better really. The majority of cases will settle before court proceedings are commenced however.

All the best.

Slim

^ Quality post.

So is there a list anywhere of the best lawyers to go with?

I've been in contact with CycleAid regarding an injury I have sustained in an RTA. They seem great, but I have been thinking if there is a claim to be made then I should go with the lawyers that will get me the most money (this may sound slightly distasteful).

I contacte National Accident Helpline, but they seemed like a big call centre operation in comparison to Cycle Aid's small office, which i prefer.

Should I assume NAH will be better at making a bigger claim or should i consider that a specialist cycling lawyer might know how to make the case for a cycling injury better than a company that deals with all personal injuries?

any help appreciated.

Ask NAH who will be dealing with your case. They'll say "A fully qualified case-progression manager". Ask them if that person is a qualified solicitor or barrister. The answer may shock you! The big firms churn cases and seem to be more likely to put you under pressure to settle -- the quicker it's dealt with, the less it costs them. The smaller firms will be just as competent, and a specialist cycling firm is definitely a plus when making a cycling claim. Best thing is to try and get hold of someone who has used cycle aid and ask them how they were treated. There are a couple of recommendations in this thread, somewhere.

this thread is going on my desktop stright away
when i was hit, but a complete idiot i did none of the above 'sensible things'
the driver shouted at me for making a human shaped dent in his car, and witnesses just carried on about there business, only one man asked if i was alright, as he offered me a fag
and then i cycled to hospital with a shattered collarbone
but now, if (fingers crossed) i have anoter accident i wil know how to go about dealing with it
but i was younger and more niave then i am now, just a little though

If you can get hold of a copy of LCC or visit lcc.org they may have some links to solicitors helping in bike accidents

Thanks, portugeezer. http://www.lcc.org.uk/ is the web-site URL.

Oliver
LCC

https://secure.met.police.uk/roadsafelondon/


report it

( text erased)

I am using Philip Hunter of
Leigh Day & Co
Priory House
25 St John's Lane
London
EC1M 4LB

And have been happy with the service to date, although I've not settled yet