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Old 10th July 2012   #51
Dammit
 
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Right- if you are going to have one wheelset that will see duty for both time trials and racing would you go for a 606 style pair with a shallower front, or an 808 style pair?
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Old 10th July 2012   #52
Chalfie
Which ones will you take less pictures of?
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Old 10th July 2012   #53
Dammit
 
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The slower ones
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Old 11th July 2012   #54
Chalfie
I think you've got the forum's answer then.
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Old 11th July 2012   #55
_dan_
 
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^lol


Neil, just having one pair of 808's for racing is pretty ludicrous - in fact having ridden my Rovals for 4-ish months I'm inclined to say that even 45mm deep rims are too much in anything over 10 mph wind (and I'm a heavy fucker). I would always want another pair of low profile wheels to switch to.

For the record, I know "pro's race on 80mm" on flat stages / breakaway stages, but honestly their bike handling skills are completely out of reach of you and I.
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Old 11th July 2012   #56
Dammit
 
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Chalfie- voice of the forum.

Dan- intention is to use the CX bike for less than clement conditions, the good bike is scared of rain so stays at home in those circumstances.

Question is would a 606 pair be usable more of the time, to which I think the answer is yes.

However much has been made of the aero profile of modern rims making a 90mm perform like an older 50mm- which I have been using for 1,000 miles or so now (over two wheelsets).
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Old 11th July 2012   #57
hippy
 
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Does anyone wind tunnel test bathroom scales?
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Old 11th July 2012   #58
Señor Bear
 
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Rates thread 1 star
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Old 11th July 2012   #59
_dan_
 
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^agreed
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Old 11th July 2012   #60
_dan_
 
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mergatron wos ere
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Old 11th July 2012   #61
Dammit
 
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Old 11th July 2012   #62
lanerdonor
 
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This thread is now less aero
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Old 11th July 2012   #63
hippy
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _dan_ View Post
mergatron wos ere
Posted the same link as Dammit.. in 2008..
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Old 11th July 2012   #64
Dammit
 
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Attracted the same amount of comment/interest both times it would appear.
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Old 11th July 2012   #65
hippy
 
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Which is why bikeradar and timetriallingforum get more interest for this kind of thing.

bikeradar >>>
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Old 11th July 2012   #66
SPdonor
 
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Old 11th July 2012   #67
hippy
 
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Europcar's next TT helmet ^
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Old 11th July 2012   #68
umop3pisdndonor
 
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I suppose this is a better place to ask than the TdF thread...

Quote:
Something I've been wondering is why does Wiggins use a trispoke for TTs when the rest of the peleton are sticking to 50-80mm deep rims? Can't imagine Sky not using the fastest wheel available, and it seems odd for them to be the only ones on Hed 3s.
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Old 11th July 2012   #69
sohi
 
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it depends a lot on the type of rim. zipp 808 are fast but mavic cosmic carbones are not aero at all.
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Old 11th July 2012   #70
sohi
 
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here is a tour magazin test in english
http://www.tour-magazin.de/services/...e104.html#/104
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Old 11th July 2012   #71
_dan_
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by umop3pisdn View Post
I suppose this is a better place to ask than the TdF thread...
I imagine it's for one of the following reasons (or a combination of)

1) trispoke is more aerodynamic
2) Other riders worrying about sidewinds with trispoke, Wiggins more comfortable on it having used it consistently on the track (though obviously without wind)
3) Some financial/logistic thing where other teams are reluctant to bring wheels that have no other purpose, or that they can't offer to all the riders. I dunno.
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Old 11th July 2012   #72
hoops
I dont understand how any of this will make any noticeable difference to a hairy legged 4th cat.
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Old 11th July 2012   #73
_dan_
 
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Dr Bobby has diagnosed you fat and hairy.
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Old 11th July 2012   #74
Chalfie
Not fat. Just hairy.
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Old 11th July 2012   #75
hippy
 
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And slow.
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Old 11th July 2012   #76
Chalfie
This is the place of rad fixie skidderz. We don't need no aero talk.
Unless it involves chocolate.
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Old 11th July 2012   #77
_dan_
 
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.

Last edited by _dan_; 12th July 2012 at 11:09.
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Old 12th July 2012   #78
peter vdonor
 
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in one pic, from this month's Grinta (Belgium) magazine



1 = normal road bike

2 = aero wheels

3 = TT bars

4 = TT bike + helmet

5 = other TT bike, aero suit + helmet + rear disc wheel
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Old 12th July 2012   #79
Dammit
 
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What does the figure refer to Peter?

Wattage at a constant speed?
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Old 12th July 2012   #80
peter vdonor
 
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yes, they tested all kit at 42-45kmh and measured the power output. conclusion: the rider needed 155 watts less in step 5 kit and position than he did in step 1
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Old 12th July 2012   #81
RPM
Tell us something we don't know?

Thier figures, however, will be invalid as a genuine scientific test as there are no constants in the rest of the equipment or rider's position.
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Old 12th July 2012   #82
peter vdonor
 
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it's just a guideline for novices in this 'science' hoped that would be clear

but please tell us all you know then, in this thread preferrably ;-)
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Old 12th July 2012   #83
hippy
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RPM View Post
Tell us something we don't know?
Thier figures, however, will be invalid as a genuine scientific test as there are no constants in the rest of the equipment or rider's position.
I'm sure Wind Tunnel Monthly wouldn't make the same mistakes this mag did..
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Old 12th July 2012   #84
PiemelPiemel
 
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I read an article somewhere which looked at aero upgrades and what I remember from it is that cheap shoe covers make as much of a difference a an expensive rear disc, and a tt specific frame was about half that. I'll try to find the article because I don't remember much else.
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Old 12th July 2012   #85
hippy
 
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I find it hard to believe that shoe covers make more difference than a TT frame. In fact, it's certainly bollocks.

Shoe covers actually increase your front area slightly but making your shoes slipperier does seem to compensate for that.
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Old 12th July 2012   #87
hippy
 
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I read that article a while ago. It's comparing a standard tubing TT frame to an aero tubing TT frame which could mean anything.

Also " I don’t understand the rational of some of their wheel comparisons and why they didn’t calculate the difference between a standard rear wheel and a rear disc wheel. I tried calculating the numbers myself but couldn’t get them consistent with the numbers in the chart."

"testing shown here was done on a specially designed skinsuit for Nike, not a standard skinsuit. I’m sure this skinsuit costs in excess of $1000
"
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Old 12th July 2012   #88
hippy
 
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Your body is the bulkiest thing you are pushing through the air. Getting your body into it's smallest form factor is more important than everything else you can buy but of course it all adds up.
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Old 12th July 2012   #89
peter vdonor
 
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^ this. according to the article to which the pic belongs it makes up 75% of the speed gain with same power output
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Old 12th July 2012   #90
Chalfie
Quote:
Originally Posted by hippy View Post
Your body is the bulkiest thing you are pushing through the air. Getting your body into it's smallest form factor is more important than everything else you can buy but of course it all adds up.
Are you suggesting that losing mass off the rider/decreasing the rider size might be the best thing to do?
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Old 12th July 2012   #91
eule
there is a difference between a stick and a wall on two wheels
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Old 12th July 2012   #92
dstdonor
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by General Lucifer View Post
from the TdF thread. Don't get low, don't get little; just put wires up your selves.
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Old 12th July 2012   #93
hippy
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chalfie View Post
Are you suggesting that losing mass off the rider/decreasing the rider size might be the best thing to do?
It's a contributing factor, yes. Less body fat is less size and also allows you to get lower without legs hitting stomach.

But there's more to it than that. Flexibility, the ability to hold your neck out down and low, etc. Shrug your shoulders and your arms are closer in. Raise and lower saddle to flatten back or reduce shoulders exposed to air. There's lots of things you can alter about your position whatever your body shape.
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Old 12th July 2012   #94
hippy
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dst View Post
from the TdF thread. Don't get low, don't get little; just put wires up your selves.
Kinky.
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Old 12th July 2012   #95
RPM
Quote:
Originally Posted by peter v View Post

but please tell us all you know then, in this thread preferrably ;-)
I could, but it would take time, which I can't afford to give for free. And some plonker would still misunderstand it or simply disagree (despite having no knowledge) because that's what the Internet is for.

The problem with Internet forums is that people are always looking for quick fixes, they leap onto the latest thing and hope it's a 'catch all' for their deficiencies, but nothing ever is.
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Old 12th July 2012   #96
dstdonor
 
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I am 10kg overweight, eat and drink too much, didn't do any miles over winter, can't be bothered to train properly. What can I buy that will make me a winner?
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Old 12th July 2012   #97
hippy
 
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A car?
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Old 12th July 2012   #98
RPM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chalfie View Post
Are you suggesting that losing mass off the rider/decreasing the rider size might be the best thing to do?
Eureka.

But, like all things, only up to the point before it becomes impractical/uncomfortable/unhealthy.

But why worry about diet, exercise, lifestyle and training when you can apparently 'buy speed'?
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Old 12th July 2012   #99
RPM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hippy View Post
A car?
Give that man a banana.
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Old 12th July 2012   #100
Object
 
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Can I buy speed from you RPM?
My usual dealer is out of town.
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